How Your 20s Shaped Your Relationships

Episode Transcript

Debra (00:00.94)
Hello everyone, welcome back. This is Jung on purpose. I am Deborah Maldonado.

Dr. Rob (00:06.54)
Dr. Rob, welcome.

Debra (00:08.237)
And we are excited to continue our series on the archetypal family field. A little intro to our work here in this new methodology we are teaching and also talking about adolescence. Last week we talked about the early adolescence and 10, nine or 10 to 18. And now we’re getting into the meat of it when we’re 19 to 25, where we’re really.

Thinking we’re adults now, we go to college, we start our first job, we get in our first major relationship and what happens there. But before we begin, I do want to ask you a favor. And if you could subscribe to our channel if you’re watching us on YouTube, or if you’re listening to us on the podcast services like Spotify and iTunes, please just click that subscribe button helps us reach more people and share this information. So Rob.

Dr. Rob (01:02.536)
Absolutely. Yeah.

Debra (01:04.174)
18 to 25, I think those were the worst years of my life. They were so hard for me. How about you? They were the funnest for you maybe. Yeah.

Dr. Rob (01:10.087)
no.

They were relatively good compared to my teenage years. I was one of those kids that had difficulties, especially around 14, 15. I was in trouble and I needed help. But luckily there were people that helped me out and I’m always grateful to them. But yeah, by

17, 18, I understood that I was entering legally into adulthood and whatever I did would have consequences. And so I got my my shite together as much as I could, given the circumstance. But yeah, it’s a special time. And here again, we see that

Debra (01:51.118)
I can’t do the things.

Debra (01:57.718)
Act together. Yeah.

Dr. Rob (02:10.094)
our formative years really continue into our 20s, into our mid 20s, because we’re still kind of finding our way in the world, finding our place and exploring. And these are great times to explore, to really try out different things. I was lucky enough to enjoy reading

And actually I had skipped a lot of high school. And so I think that’s what preserved my interest in reading and learning. Because a lot of my friends that stayed in school, they were turned off to knowledge and reading and all that stuff. They didn’t want anything to do with it. As soon as they finished high school, they were, you know, ready to do something else. Whereas I was only starting to really get interested in books and art and science.

and so I ended up at the university back at the university and kind of, I had to do a lot of remedial kind of work because I didn’t know how to write at that time. I knew how to read, thank God, but I didn’t know how to write. So I had to learn how to write anyway. So it’s a different time where our persona now, our personalities really starts to gel because we. Yeah. It’s a sad like cement.

Debra (03:35.33)
So success. Yeah.

Dr. Rob (03:39.278)
But it’s still flexible, flexible enough to try different things, to explore different facets of our lives.

Debra (03:50.191)
Do you think too, like I was telling, we talked about this earlier that say the kid who was like the burnout and the, you know, the guy that never would succeed all of sudden gets his act together and then goes to college and then like it becomes this like financial guy and starts wearing a suit and starts being serious. So it’s almost like we create a new persona or we try on like a new persona, but it lasts longer than when we were younger where we were changing.

trading personas all the time, trying to figure it out. And now we’re starting to like, hmm, maybe I don’t want to be that person anymore. want to reject my youth and I want to be a grownup now. So I’m going to have a new persona. For me, I remember just my friends used to say, like, I was like 19 or 20 and I really wanted to get married.

but I never showed that to anyone. I was always acting like fun Debbie, I called her the persona of, don’t take me serious, I just wanna have fun because I thought that’s what guys liked. Guys didn’t want a girl who was desperate for marriage, so I pretended to be this like other person and with my friends I was real, but they were like, why do you act that way in like public when you’re meeting men and guys, when you’re going out? And I was like, I don’t know. I don’t know why I do that.

But I also thought it was a defense mechanism from my early family field. What I learned about myself later on is I really didn’t want to be a housewife to anyone. didn’t want to be, my father was very strict, so I didn’t want a man to control me. So I basically unconsciously created this sabotaging persona that then no one would pick me. I would only not be taken seriously.

We create these personas and we have to remember their defense mechanisms. They’re not who we are, but we decide that this is gonna keep me the safest from what I really fear. And what I really feared was being in a controlling environment where I had no freedom. So I don’t know if that resonates with anyone. If you had that kind of feeling, some people sabotage jobs because they don’t wanna be in a structured corporate environment, so they get fired all the time.

Dr. Rob (05:57.197)
Hmph.

Dr. Rob (06:01.41)
Yeah.

Debra (06:09.006)
quit, or they can’t don’t know what they want to do with their life. And so there’s a lot of things that we do with our persona that’s preserving something, but we’re fearing something, and it’s helping us develop that. So we get a chance to basically start to form some sort of will in ourselves to decide our future on some level.

Dr. Rob (06:32.802)
very much so. The ego is maturing at this time, meaning you’re starting to feel your oats as human being and

Debra (06:41.952)
I sowed many oats.

Dr. Rob (06:44.32)
and make really important decisions that they’re not like in childhood, we make decisions about who we are, that identity again. But here we’re making decisions about what we’re going to do with our life, with our time, with our energy and our talents. But, you know, to get a little bit more nuanced about those defense mechanisms that you mentioned, they do play a big role in

the things that we choose for us, especially in relationships and in work. But Jung would say these are complexes that are playing out. So the complex is like you’re describing.

Debra (07:29.72)
Let’s talk about what the complex is for people that don’t know, but they think of like the inferiority complex or the mother complex. Yeah. I’m the queen of father complexes.

Dr. Rob (07:32.759)
Yeah, so let’s go with the father complex because you mentioned kind of your approach to relationships. Yeah, here you have a young woman who is sabotaging her relationships because of her father complex. Now, complexes, we’re not saying they’re pathological. They’re simply part of

growing and defining our persona, our personality, and also deciding what doesn’t fit our personality, which is the shadow or becomes the shadow. And the conflict

Debra (08:15.8)
But there’s also kind of a conflict too, right, between those ideas.

Dr. Rob (08:18.902)
Yeah, the internal conflict then is that you your identity was shaped consciously by feminism at that time, perhaps, and the ideas that were in the culture at that time, versus the expectations of the father, they were in conflict. So we can say that internal conflict, like that’s the nucleus of it, then you

Debra (08:31.619)
Yes.

Dr. Rob (08:48.558)
you record or you experience things from that perspective. In other words, you filter things through that perspective of what’s gonna be good for me and what doesn’t fit the things that I wanna do as a feminist person.

Debra (09:06.912)
And I wasn’t aware of it actually, you know, that idea, because I, on another level, adding to the complex is I really wanted to get married. So I wanted to get married, but I didn’t want to be controlled. And I didn’t think they could be mutually together. Like it had to be one or the other. Like you get married and then you lose all your power and you’re submissive to your husband or you be free, but you’re lonely. Like, so which one is better?

And so I was constantly like having that battle within myself and it was showing up when there were men that wanted to be serious with me and I was like, I don’t know. And then there were men that didn’t want to be serious with me I’m like, Hey, I like him. And so I was kind of going back and forth and I thought, why are these men that I like not wanting to commit to me? And I didn’t realize it was my own complex was stopping it. And so I thought, well, maybe I’m not pretty enough or maybe I need to be cooler or maybe.

Maybe I’m too needy. I did, I was trying to, you know, the dating tips, figure it all out that way. Uh, reading all like the self-help books in my early twenties, trying to figure myself out, but it was all behavior changes. So there is a deeper layer is what you’re saying. So the family field, that initial before nine, witnessing the dynamics of the household, who I want to be then in junior high, like deciding what I want to be. And then now an adulthood, that other layer of now.

I’m now it’s time to really get serious about finding a partner, you know, and all that plays into that activity. And we think it’s just about finding the right person at the right time. And you’re meant to be together and your soulmate appears. but there’s a lot more to that. There’s a lot more to our psychology than just on the surface or going on 50 dates or a hundred dates. And eventually one of them will work out, that type of thing, playing by the numbers. Like,

My one friend told me it’s a numbers game. I’m like, no, it’s

Dr. Rob (11:06.796)
Yeah, and then that’s the problem with the part of the culture today that a lot there’s a lot of pop psychology that kind of simplifies it and says, well, it’s because your family messed you up and now you’re having difficulties forming relationships or attachment patterns and these kinds of things. There’s something to that, of course, but it’s oversimplified. The complex is more internal.

Remember, we internalize the family system and it becomes part of how we see the world and see our role in the world. And therefore, for you, was, and this is oversimplified, of course, it’s more nuanced than that, but for you, it was, there’s a controlling father, which means it translates as to, I do not want to.

to get into a relationship like my mom and dad had because I will be controlled by the man and therefore I reject that unconsciously perhaps.

Debra (12:14.41)
And it was an assumption because my parents had a really great marriage and I projected all that onto my father because he was very strict. And I just like, that’s the thing about a complex. You make all these assumptions about your parents and who they are. And so to blame your parents for your life, you have to take responsibility for your own projections with them. I think that’s important. But also I want to say that most people in the pop psychology was like, you had trauma.

from your childhood. And that’s why your relationship is all messy. Think about this. I had this powerful part of me that said, I want my own power in my life. What a beautiful, beautiful piece of my psyche, right? That why would I want to get rid of that? You know, it’s just got all convoluted with all the other narratives and the the projections and all those things. And I was, you know, didn’t have the knowledge I have now and unconsciously.

creating this persona that, you know, wouldn’t find or even choose, not even choosing men that would want to be in a relationship, not knowing why. But it was that seed, we have to think about those, the seed of our complexes have something really beautiful for us, that was created because there’s a part of us, a spiritual part of us that wanted something better and wanted something. So,

Dr. Rob (13:13.038)
Mm-hmm.

Debra (13:37.132)
We don’t want to pathologize it because inside of that is some gold.

Dr. Rob (13:41.899)
Exactly. And it’s like you say, it’s a defense in a way because it helps us survive. First of all, the emotional environment that’s going on in the family. helps us adapt to that. like we’re, you were playing a certain role within that family, perhaps the rebel or the trickster or something, right. and then you carry that on into your relationships where

it ends up sabotaging your relationships like you said because you might meet a good person but because of that fear of being controlled you unconsciously sabotage it you know you find a way to not make it work and then to blame the other person you say there’s no good men out there or no good partners

Debra (14:30.21)
And then I did tons of personal growth work about healing the relationship with my father and I have to do more healing and healing and healing. And that wasn’t getting anywhere because it was projecting that he was the problem. And I wasn’t seeing, and thanks to Jungian psychology, starting to see that, maybe I’m the one who’s not available. Maybe I’m the one who is, is pushing love away. And when I realized that, when I realized that it was right before I met you.

I said, wait, if I choose, if I’ve been pushing men away my whole life, then that means I have the power to choose to not push them away. And then I met you six weeks later. It was like really quick. So it’s like, when you make it conscious, your whole field starts shifting that archetypal family field. it’s almost like it expands to more possibility than the, and when we’re not conscious, it’s slowly stealth mode running your life and telling you.

who you are, who loves you, and who doesn’t love you, and what a relationship is and how to be, but all that really powerful stuff. Let’s talk about success too, because I think this is really important. This is where we pick our first career, where we start to, you know, we get out of college and we’re starting to figure out what do I want to do with my life and pick a career. Sometimes we go to college and we know exactly what we’re going to do.

Many times we get out and go, I don’t know what to do. I don’t know what to do with this liberal arts degree. So we start searching again, right? We don’t have that persona fully, fully online yet of who, how we fit into the

Dr. Rob (16:11.042)
Yeah, that’s a unique aspect of our current age is that we have so many opportunities, almost like too many opportunities where it confuses people and they end up either staying in jobs that they don’t really like and don’t really want to do. But they think because it’s giving me enough money to survive and

live my lifestyle in a certain way that I need to stay and I can’t go and move from these things. A lot of that those choices in the kind of work that we do, the kind of money we make are coming from the complexes we inherit from our families early on. And that’s the blind spot.

Debra (17:01.59)
in the field. Yeah. And so we’re not aware of it. Some people are like, I don’t want to grow up poor. I’m going to go and get an advanced degree and I’m going to be successful and never have to worry about money like my parents did.

Dr. Rob (17:17.92)
Well, they’re conscious in a certain way because often the interpretation is made behaviorally. Like I chose these things because I didn’t want those things. But what’s underneath that? That’s really in shadow work, we’re able to kind of find what are the roots of those decisions that you make and that appear to be conscious. In other words, the real root is unconscious.

The root of our decisions is in the unconscious. Therefore, it’s not totally free will. It’s being driven by past conditioning, past experiences, these unconscious complexes that are still operating in our mind and our psyche.

Debra (18:06.166)
And so then what happens 26 to 32 is it, it’s more the even more solid the ego and the persona becomes like a iron mask, where we start to really set in and a lot of people in the late 20s have started a family, you know, they start have their first marriage, they start a family, maybe not anymore. people aren’t having kids anymore, according to the stats, but maybe in our generation or generation before us.

Dr. Rob (18:29.538)
Nobody’s getting married anymore.

Debra (18:35.946)
that’s the time where you’re like, kind of like, okay, now I have to be responsible. not in college anymore. I gotta like pay the bills, I gotta get maybe your first house or your first home, you know, where you’re responsible for the human beings, a partner. So it’s almost like we are world kind of shrinks again. So we kind of expands when we go into junior high, because we’re trying to look everything’s new. And then we go to college and still everything’s new and the

choices about career and partners are new. And then at that late 20s, it starts to get small again and tight again of, okay, now we have this like persona now and this ego. And so it’s preparing us for the next stage. But let’s talk about that last stage before we’re 30 in our 30s.

Dr. Rob (19:13.358)
Mm-hmm.

Dr. Rob (19:26.368)
Yeah, well, one of the big things that’s happening is that we have more life behind us. And so the narrative is becoming more nuanced and more detailed.

Debra (19:42.658)
What does that mean? The narrative is becoming.

Dr. Rob (19:42.7)
What? Yeah, if we’re on a we’re on the hero’s journey, it means now the hero has a backstory.

Debra (19:52.217)
So we know our story now. We become this character. This is like solid, more developed character in our life.

Dr. Rob (20:01.646)
That’s right. And according to that narrative that we tell ourselves and we tell others about who we are, that becomes like a self fulfilling prophecy. And this is the danger of course, because let’s say we all had difficult periods in our life, in development especially, right? If those narratives or those episodes are interpreted as trauma,

as bad luck, as undestined to fail. Then they become a self-fulfilling prophecy in the things that you’re creating now, especially in work. They become kind of the filter that you see your role in life through.

Debra (20:34.062)
Wounds.

Debra (20:54.616)
Well, I could tell you from when I first started personal development readings and stuff in my early 20s, I kept thinking something’s wrong with me. And then the books told me there’s something wrong with you. You have a codependency, is ancient. I know I’m ancient. Codependency, or you have this attachment style, or you have this, and there’s something wrong with you.

Dr. Rob (21:01.251)
Mm-hmm.

Debra (21:22.602)
And so not only was I trying to read self-help to feel better about myself or self-improvement, right? And then at the same time I’m getting, but yeah, these are all the things that are wrong with you and why your life is not working. And I mean, some things really helped. I had more self-awareness, but it was that subtle message that you have problems. And I looked at the world and everyone seems to be getting married and having kids and having a life and not reading self-help.

And I noticed many of you who are into personal growth and none of your friends are, could kind of think, you feel like the identified patient in your life, that you have all these problems and everyone else has a perfect life. And so I think that when we approach personal growth, and this is kind of my heart and my message all the time, is that it’s not about fixing yourself. It’s about understanding yourself. And the more you understand yourself, the more power you have over your life. So.

All these things that we talked about in our development are part of a healthy mind. The mind creates defenses. The mind creates patterns to survive. These are all very typical developmental processes. We all go through, no one talks about them and not everyone seeks personal growth. But because you do, it doesn’t mean you’re broken. It doesn’t mean something’s wrong with you. And if you’re reading a book that says this is what’s wrong with you, then I would

think about what you’re reading because it does, for me, it made me feel worse about myself and I felt like I was never gonna be enough because I kept uncovering all these things that were wrong with me about my psychology and that’s why I’m not married and why I don’t have a partner and why I’m not successful, why I haven’t found the right career. And I feel like we could do a better job of that, us in the industry, to help empower people.

Dr. Rob (23:13.87)
Yeah, I think we’re starting to come out of that cult of trauma gradually. I’ve seen a couple of articles where it’s talking about that we over pathologize a lot of our human experiences that are, yeah, they’re difficult and challenging for us, but they’re meant to fortify us to

Debra (23:19.918)
Starting. yeah

Debra (23:30.638)
Mm-hmm.

Dr. Rob (23:41.647)
create resilience in us, to, you for us to be carrying it around for the rest of our lives. And so this empowerment model of coaching that we’re developing and we’re applying seems to give people their power back. They’re empowered to understand that, yeah, if I created all these things in my life, although they were unconscious, now,

As I become conscious, can undo them and create something new.

Debra (24:15.192)
Yeah, you’re never locked into a destiny.

Dr. Rob (24:17.772)
Yeah. And that’s one of the big lessons of Jung’s work is that if you remain or avoid things, they remain unconscious. And that’s when they’re dangerous. Not going into the unconscious. Yeah. Yeah. It’s the opposite. Most people think the unconscious is dangerous because we don’t know what’s in there. And Freud scared a lot of people with ideas of aggression and sexuality.

Debra (24:31.83)
It’s not scary to address the unconscious, like you said.

Debra (24:43.854)
Hahaha

Dr. Rob (24:47.66)
But the unconscious is our nature. Like we dream every night, meaning our unconscious is actively speaking to us every single night, giving us these powerful dreams. And we have intuition and we have connection with nature and with each other that we need now to face the challenges of our current world, our modern world, as you say.

Debra (25:12.238)
Well, know, one thing I want to mention that you’re talking about the unconscious and we were reading this week and we had this conversation because in the pop culture also they call it the subconscious mostly. And that’s the pop term. I learned that when I was a hypnotherapist, it’s a subconscious, it’s a subconscious. But you said that, I think it was Young who said, I don’t like the term subconscious because it makes the conscious mind superior and it’s sub.

conscious, like it’s, just a little part of us, where he felt like the unconscious was a bigger, more powerful force in our life. And so if we look, think of the subconscious, we’re like, our conscious mind is directing, think positive and change your behavior and rewire this subconscious, where the subconscious is just this like little piece that has no say in anything. It’s like a lesser part of our mind.

Dr. Rob (26:06.51)
Yeah, and we certainly need a powerful ally now in facing the challenges that we face on a global level. I mean, I’m very optimistic because we have everything we need to solve every human problem. Every human problem, we have the technology, the understanding.

The manpower, the woman power that is required to solve these problems. The only thing that’s lacking is our own understanding of our own power. We were projecting our power onto AI and onto technology and unto other people. These, these corporate geniuses or, you know, uh, social media personalities. That’s not where the power is. The power is within you. You as a conscious human being.

have amazing power to transform your life first of all and then the culture. And it has to begin with you. If you don’t change your own sense of empowerment, you won’t be able to help others. You won’t be able to help society.

Debra (27:22.818)
and you’ll be taking from the world versus giving back. And so one of the things about the family fields, the archetypal family field that we teach is that it’s this internal field. We see our family and then we have these amagos that are like images, inner images of our mother, our father, our siblings, our parts of ourselves. these, this field,

of images that are internal show up in our world. So we end up seeing our father in our work. We end up seeing our mother in our relationships. We end up seeing our siblings in our friendships. so the world, like we have this like in our world, it’s almost like a hologram where the field is this creating internally is projecting out there and we’re seeing a mirror of our own inner world. So

When you talk about the unconscious, what we’re really seeing is the parts in the world we’re seeing the unconscious, the parts of ourselves that are not conscious to us are showing up in everyone else and in the world and in situations. So when we make that the outer conflicts in our life are reflecting inner conflicts, they’re reflecting those complexes. So when we have a struggle with someone, we have a conflict with someone, when things aren’t working out, we have issues with money.

We have issues with authority. They’re all reflecting what’s inside. It’s not about behaving different or acting a certain way so you can have authority. It’s what’s going on inside me that’s not experiencing that. And that’s really where the power is that the world is reflecting our mind. And if that’s the case, then if we can access our mind, the parts that we can’t see, we’re able to change our life and the life out there changes. So the inner world.

is always a reflection of the app.

Dr. Rob (29:22.07)
I love, you know, one of the complexes that you mentioned was the inherited emotional burden that it passed down from the parent to the child. What is that?

Debra (29:29.783)
Yes.

Debra (29:38.315)
Okay. Yeah, Rob and I were driving on the street, driving on the street, of course, for the car. And we were talking about our archetypal family field system. And we were, it’s so fascinating and, just like keeps evolving as we keep working with it. And these new insights come through. And one of the things we, you know, we’re looking at neuroscience and in neuroscience, they say that we get caught up in loops. So when we have an emotion, like

even an event that we don’t know how to complete, an unfulfilled emotional loop, they start, they just spin. So that’s what happens with anxiety, you just kind of spin and you’re spinning. But even in everyday life, we’re always like chasing something. We’re always like that, you know, that feeling where you’re, you’re compelled to do something, or you feel like you’re never enough, or you feel like you need to go to the next level, or you have to find that partner.

Those are emotional loops that our brain is processing and it’s psychological. And what happens is that we didn’t create them ourselves. We inherited them as we were around our family, they have their loops and their parents pass down their loops of emotional fulfillment that they never achieved. And it’s like to belong, to be accepted.

to be abundant, to not worry about money, to not worry about being heard or seen. And those unprocessed or like incomplete loops that keep spinning, you inherit it. And the reason I say inherit because you’re not consciously saying, I’m going to fix that for my parents. It’s almost like you take on that burden of

Let’s say my father always worried about money. For example, I don’t know if he did, but let’s say he did, then the child would absorb that worry about money, that money, always, and then you wonder why this person’s always saving all the time or worried about interest rates or worrying about their dad and kind of processing all the time and they can never relax. And they’re basically taking on that emotional burden from the parent and then passing it down. And then if you don’t resolve it,

Debra (32:02.69)
you’ll pass it down to your children or even people around you. So that’s what the inherited emotional burden is. It’s a burden that we are responsible for completing it. Like we feel like, okay, now I have to fix this for them in some way. And sometimes we do it by, let’s say the father worried about money that we become really successful. And so we create this cycle, but it’s never enough. So we know it’s a loop if it doesn’t satisfy us. So the emotion is never kind of

has a completion to it. And so think about your life and the things that drive you that feel very unsettled, like you’re never satisfied with. And then that’s really when we do the, if you are interested in learning to train in this and the archetypal family field system, that’s what we address. That’s what the complex is. It’s this like emotional burden that we’re trying to like navigate and figure out and complete. It’s like a puzzle that’s not ever complete.

And then there’s also a ancestral burden that we take on from humanity. mean, all of us have this universal burdens as human beings of fear of death, fear of starvation, like all these main survival, emotional driven tendencies that we have. And so the thing is,

Dr. Rob (33:24.204)
What is the upside or the flip side that if we do

Debra (33:26.946)
Well, the upside is that we get to complete it. get to, we think the way to complete it is doing something externally. So we think, okay, my dad’s worried about money, so I’m gonna make a lot of money, so I never have to have that burden. But then you end up never having enough because it’s never enough. It’s a million dollars, it’s $2 million, it’s $3 million, and it’s never enough. Like it’s not solving the problem. And those of you who are in midlife, you know what I’m talking about?

is that you got that career. You thought, you know, if I get that promotion, I’ve made CEO or I made a certain amount of money, I got that dream house or, you know, that then it’ll be fine. That loop doesn’t get, get complete externally. And so what we do is what we need to do is go in and say, what is really the nature of this need of a fear of not having money? And it’s more of a philosophical question. It’s more of an existential question.

what is this going about? And it’s unlocking us from that loop in Eastern philosophy, they call it the karma, the pain pleasure loop. And so it’s that burden, that emotional burden that chasing the carrot, right? On the horse. And how do we let go of it completely? It’s not by compensating or taking on the worry and thinking if I worry about it, then I’m at least

paying attention to it, like a lot of people think, well, if I don’t worry about it, something bad’s gonna happen. So the worrying gives you a sense of control. But we learn these patterns through our family and through humanity and through others. the deeper realization is that, why am I chasing this thing in the first place? What’s so bad about having no money? Like we’re asking different questions of ourselves.

Dr. Rob (35:17.784)
So it liberates you from harm.

Debra (35:19.382)
Yeah. So the loop, once you stop chasing it, like it’s almost like kicking a wheel, you stop kicking the wheel or chasing it. Like the gerbil gets off the wheel, it stops spinning, right? And so that’s kind of the wheel of karma that they talk about in Eastern philosophy. And that’s why our work is so powerful because it includes that we’re not only just working on our psyche and understanding our personal psychological patterns, but we’re asking ourselves these deeper questions.

Why am I chasing this? And for us, why do I need a relationship? Why do I need money? Why do I need a partnership? Why do I need to feel important? Like bigger questions. And then that’s what’s going to bring us freedom. But we need to uncouple ourselves from the patterns first, so we’re able to see it. And then the beauty of the archetypal family system is that on a deeper level, beneath our psychology is this archetypal field, which contains the pure possibility.

where we can now have these universal creative powers that we get to express in the

Dr. Rob (36:27.594)
beautifully said.

Debra (36:28.996)
Do you have anything to add to that?

Dr. Rob (36:32.522)
No, think it’s one of those insights that just gives us another piece of the puzzle of development.

that it’s not all about us, right? Because as individuals, again, we’re born into a family system, a field of individuals who we’re relating to emotionally, psychologically, really connected with unconsciously and absorbing a lot of their experiences and their complexes, their unconscious.

And then we’re thinking, like you said, most of us think, oh, there’s something wrong with me because of, you know, I have all these conflicting emotions or thoughts or.

Debra (37:26.966)
I got issues. Like the baggage, people say, they have a lot of baggage.

Dr. Rob (37:31.394)
Yeah, instead of seeing it as this richness that we’ve inherited and that now we can transform it into our own power through inner.

Debra (37:43.469)
And we do need to chase the wheel and be on that wheel, the first part of life. It’s like we’re not, none of us are going to be enlightened and be like, let go of the world. mean, part of us being in the world is to be in the world and be totally consumed with it in the beginning and be unconscious and build a persona and chase those dreams and create this eye. And Young says that that process helps us understand the individual soul.

that gives us like a framework of who, like a more solid sense of individuality that we can now, it’s like our kicking off point. Now we can, but we can still hold ourselves. We’re not like a blurred person that doesn’t have any edges to it at all. We have some sense of consistency that we can now enter this bigger field of possibilities for our life. But the big thing is it’s not about healing the past.

It’s about seeing what gift does it have for us? What happened to us that helped us, you know, just even thinking about my will to not be controlled is a beautiful thing. Instead of just falling in line and being blind and asleep my whole life and being unhappy and not knowing why. anyway, that’s for another day. So next episode, we’ll talk a little bit about the digital.

field, which is a new field that’s emerging, thanks to our friends at Instagram and Meta and TikTok and X and all the social media, Facebook, that we are, you know, our world, our field of social field has expanded in the past 20 years. And what do we do with this expanded field and how it does that affect our initial family field and how

Dr. Rob (39:23.768)
Check your PC.

Debra (39:42.287)
in the world. So great next episode. Look forward to it next week. In the meantime, it was great to spend time with you today and we hope to see you soon. Bye-bye.

Dr. Rob (39:43.842)
look forward to.

Dr. Rob (39:52.985)
See you soon, stay well.